Dec 29, 2024
Loving Where We Live, with Upstream Minnesota Executive Director Andy Goldman-Gray

Our Speaker this Sunday, Andy Goldman-Gray, a member of Unity Unitarian in St. Paul and the Executive Director of Upstream Minnesota, has spent his career helping connect people with their passion for community service. He has led campaigns that have raised billions of dollars for community issues such as his involvement in helping start GiveMN, and he takes pride in his ability to connect with people from across political, racial and geographic differences. As stated on the Upstream web site, “Living Upstream”  means sharing a common love of our state’s natural places, and demonstrating our way of caring for it. Expect to hear... a daily dose of optimism, hope and connection in his talk with us.

Pilgrim House Unitarian Universalist Fellowship of Arden Hills, Minnesota
pilgrimhouseuua.org
pilgrimhouse@pilgrimhouseuua.org

TRANSCRIPT
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NOTE: This is the transcript from Zoom and there are likely errors contained below. No effort has been made to proof read.
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10:15:38 Welcome to Pilgrim House.
10:15:43 I think everybody's in here pretty much. We are a lay-led fellowship welcoming all. Can you turn me down a little bit?
10:15:53 Fred is a one-man show today. I have to go lower if we're going to do that.
10:16:02 We are a lay-led fellowship welcoming all. Regardless of race, gender, sexual or spiritual orientation.
10:16:11 We have no creed. Rather, we encourage openness to ideas. Here we explore, develop, and apply our own individual beliefs With the acceptance and encouragement of our fellow pilgrims.
10:16:22 And we welcome the spirits of those to whom this lamb was once a homeland.
10:16:27 The last of which were the Dakota. We recognize your claim.
10:16:31 And hope that we are using it for a purpose that you can consider appropriate.
10:16:36 Our program today focuses on our seventh principle, respect for the interdependent web.
10:16:42 Of all existence of which we are a part. And today I'm going to light the chalice with a reading from Shan Woodbury, Sherry Woodbury.
10:16:51 It's called Alive in All Creation. Spark of the Spirit.
10:16:57 Cupped in Earth's embrace. Light of love alive in all creation.
10:17:03 As we kindle this flame. We rekindle our connection to the sacred web.
10:17:09 Of life.
10:17:20 First Congregate song will be projected in a moment. Love is a doctrine.
10:17:29 One of the themes of today's program being loving where we live.
10:17:34 I thought this might be an appropriate one. We haven't done it in a while, but… I'm sure you'll remember it. I'll play it through once and we'll go.

10:28:11 For our meditation today, I chilled. Chose a reading.
10:28:16 Written by Ellen H.P. Rivers. All of my, most of my things come from The UUA worship.
10:28:26 Site that has words for services. This one's called Blanket Fort Prayers. I haven't thought about a blanket fort.
10:28:34 For a little bit. My guys are… Almost out of that stage.
10:28:38 Meet me at the altar of banned books. Blanket fort sanctuary.
10:28:47 We will dance to a chorus of children's laughter. Meet me in the joy, the sorrow.
10:28:56 This is a hallmark of my presentations. Beneath the rainbow banner.
10:29:01 Bring your questions, cares, concerns. Bring the glitter in your pocket.
10:29:10 Stop there moving. Sorry. And the sparkle in your smile. Bring your heavy heart.
10:29:16 Your favorite mug. Your very best sweet words.
10:29:23 Sit down your very best. Bravest face.
10:29:30 Meet me in the heartbeat. Between what has been and what will be.
10:29:35 Meet me in the flicker of our eternal flame. We need not face this moment.
10:29:41 Alone. There's Huey. I needed him up here.
10:29:45 He kept me going last week. Okay, for our pro up, we have Mel, Bill. I always forget you. I'm sorry. Go ahead.
10:29:53 Some music.
10:30:58 Thanks, Mel. Bill. God, I can't get anybody's names right today. Sorry about that Well, today our program is being presented by Andy Goldman Gray. He is the Executive Director of Upstream.
10:31:11 He spent his career in cause marketing, helping to connect people with their passion for community service.
10:31:17 It's here. I have it. He's led campaigns that have raised billions of dollars for community issues.
10:31:25 Helped start Give Minnesota. Give him in and takes pride in his ability to connect.
10:31:32 With people from across political, racial, and geographical differences. He, his wife, and four college-age kids live in White Bear Lake.
10:31:42 Andy grew up at Unity Unitarian in St. Paul. And spends his outdoor time split between Hiking in the state parks and at the Honor Lake Dog Part with Clover, his Wheaton Terrier.
10:31:55 Please help me welcome Andy Goldman Gray.
10:32:03 Thanks, Lolly. Yep.
10:32:09 Good morning, everyone. Good morning. I'm a frustrated environmentalist.
10:32:15 So I want you to go back to 2016. An administration change.
10:32:20 And a whole raft of environmental protections and administrative rules were wiped off the books, opening up drilling and exploration in lands that we thought were protected.
10:32:31 That same year, I was out in Washington with an organization called Citizens Climate Lobby Which goes and talks to lawmakers about lawmakers things that relate to climate protection.
10:32:42 And we'd go into a lawmaker that had a D behind their name.
10:32:48 And those folks would let us sit down and talk to them about it. And they would say, we're on your side. You don't have to worry about us, and then dismiss us.
10:32:56 And then we go across the hall to someone with the R behind their name.
10:33:00 And we wouldn't get FaceTime. We wouldn't. Be seen by the people who held the levers of power.
10:33:05 And I left that trip really, really frustrated because there were some big, big issues that we knew we had to solve as a people.
10:33:13 And the folks who are supposed to help weren't there to help.
10:33:19 Yeah, let's pull up the slide deck, please.
10:33:24 Thanks.
10:33:35 Yeah, great. Thanks. All right, so the word of the year for 2024 was polarization That's the Merriam-Webster's word of the year.
10:33:46 So that was a word that showed up in a lot of different publications and a lot of different stories, that kind of thing.
10:33:52 At the same time, 2024 was the hottest year on record.
10:33:56 And places in Minnesota that we value and love are changing faster than others.
10:34:00 The further north you go in Minnesota, the faster the seasons are changing. Did anyone take part in the Christmas Day bird count?
10:34:08 So I got to do that. My dad's an ornithologist. I've gotten it, you know, I just know birds now. I think it must come through DNA.
10:34:16 And I saw a very confused Baltimore Oriole. So this is a migratory songbird that should be further south here. And birds are confused, and that's important to me.
10:34:27 So we have these two intersecting issues. We've got this intense polarization, especially around issues of environment.
10:34:33 And then we've got degradation to what's happening in Minnesota. Worth seeing a state that doesn't feel like the Minnesota that we grew up in.
10:34:42 So in 2017, a really smart guy named John Larson Who is a friend of mine. We worked on the GiveNN board together. He was also one of the driving forces behind the Marriage Equality campaign.
10:34:55 Pulled together a group of people around his dining room table. So these were people on the left and the right and the center.
10:34:59 Environmental leaders, communicators, some political strategists, and said, why is the environmental movement so feckless?
10:35:08 Why is power that seems to be created in the environmental movement not stick around? Why is it not durable?
10:35:13 And the folks around that table said. It's an interesting question.
10:35:18 They banded about an idea about maybe doing a constitutional amendment, probably something protecting our lakes and rivers, the things that are really important in Minnesota.
10:35:25 And that group said, you can't do it. The politics of environmentalism is too polarized. You have to go upstream.
10:35:32 Of politics and work on culture. So this was the kernel of an idea that became this organization called Upstream that I have the pleasure of leading.
10:35:41 Upstream is a hopeful and simple solution to bring people together.
10:35:45 So we channel Minnesotans love for our natural places. That cuts across political, racial, and geographic difference.
10:35:53 And to increase trust, connection, and stewardship. And the whole idea here is find people that are different.
10:36:00 Different backgrounds, different politics, different religions, different, you name it.
10:36:05 And find the things that we hold in common. Change the conversation from one about rights and environmental laws and bring it back to one about values.
10:36:13 And legacy. So we chose those three words in our mission, trust, connection, and stewardship in that order for a reason.
10:36:22 One is if we can't talk to each other and trust each other.
10:36:24 There's no way we're going to agree on what we want to do about it.
10:36:27 Right now in a time when we're being pushed apart by media algorithms. We need to bring together people in the same spaces, spaces like this to talk about what's important and what we want to do with it.
10:36:37 And then we want to use stories of each other's actions.
10:36:41 To inspire more stewardship. So let me play a short video. Let's see if it can work, Fred.
10:36:49 That gives an idea about the campaign as a whole. And then I'll talk to you a little bit about how we're showing up in different communities and invite you in.
10:37:20 If you go to the next slide and then.
10:37:38 Upstream celebrates how special Minnesota is. Our lands, fields, forests.
10:37:44 Waters and natural spaces. And shares stories of the people across the state who care for them.
10:37:51 I live upstream. I live upstream. I live upstream. We are Minnesota upstream.
10:37:59 We want to tell the stories of all kinds of people doing all kinds of brilliant work across the state.
10:38:06 And by doing that, we know that we are going to inspire more people to do good work.
10:38:11 Upstream gives me a place where I feel like the small actions that I take every day matter in support of the place that my son will inherit someday.
10:38:20 I go upstream by taking care of the land that we farm on.
10:38:24 And doing what we love. We grow all our produce right in our backyard. You hear the expression farm to table.
10:38:31 In our home it is garden to plate. We think it's special here and we will fight to protect it. There isn't an either or.
10:38:39 On one side and that side is to keep making the place better for our children and grandchildren.
10:38:45 This was our place where we live, grow. And also we embrace what Minnesota has to offer. I was born and raised here. I find this place extremely valuable. I want to make sure that we can take care of and pass this on for future generations.
10:39:00 Minnesota belongs to all of us. There's a place for everyone to celebrate and be part and feel welcome in our state.
10:39:06 You have a place at the table here. You have something to contribute and we know you love your place and we want to help you amplify your voice.
10:39:13 We can come together and care for our place together. This isn't something that divides us. This is something that brings us together.
10:39:20 This is something that builds bridges across difference. Upstream is loving where we live.
10:39:27 Join us upstream to share your stories of stewardship and inspire others to do the same.
10:39:33 Thanks, Fred. So what a… A Republican mayor from Jordan, Minnesota.
10:39:42 Among farmer from Rosemont. A native woman from a native woman from Morris, Minnesota.
10:39:50 Gay liberal architect from South Minneapolis have together. What do they have in common?
10:39:57 Minnesotans, they love this place. That's why they show up to tell their stories about about care for this place that we share. And the good news is that we actually are coming from a position of strength when it comes to connecting people across values.
10:40:08 So in a statewide survey that we did last year, 83% of Minnesotans said they trust each other as much or more than themselves to take care of this place.
10:40:16 So when you strip out politics, when you strip out The labels that we put on each other, we actually care about each other and trust each other. And interestingly enough The lottery, the renewal of the lottery winnings in the last really divisive election
10:40:30 Passed at about 80%. So it actually gives support that people will make actions to care for this place in a way that doesn't necessarily reflect what their political labels are, where they live or how they make their living.
10:40:40 And it's up to upstream. This is a really cool chart, probably going to be hard to explain in just two minutes, but we have to find the narratives, the stories that people tell about Minnesota that show that value, that reveal that value that we care about our place.
10:40:56 And the two most important narratives that Minnesotans hold across all differences that we have is that people are really proud of this place. So the two important narratives are only in Minnesota. So these are the things that we brag about.
10:41:08 So this is the 10,000 lakes and the rivers and the parks and the activities that we get to do with it.
10:41:14 And then experience Minnesota the fullest is all the things that we get to do because of those special places, canoeing, kayaking, those kind of things.
10:41:19 So all of the stories that Upstream shares has some relationship to these amazing natural places that we have and the things that we get to do because of it.
10:41:28 And our job then is to take those stories and make sure that people across difference hear them.
10:41:34 Share them, and then amplify them so that people can find a home and a tribe in this identity of being upstream Minnesotans. So our job is to Listen, learn, appreciate. So go to people who maybe you don't think of as environmentalists.
10:41:47 And hear about how they care about this place. What are the places that are important to them?
10:41:52 How do they take care of it? And everyone has a story like that, no matter where they are. There's almost nobody that you go up to that you say.
10:41:58 What do you want to do in this state? And people are like, I want to extract all the things that we can, make as much money as we can and leave this place worth for our grandchildren.
10:42:05 Nobody thinks that, right? Everyone comes from a position of, I want this place to be better. I want to do the things that I can do within my scope of control.
10:42:13 And then our job is to connect and weave those stories together so that those core values show up in it.
10:42:18 Core values of stewardship and appreciation and legacy that people want to leave for each other.
10:42:24 Then amplify that through this communication campaign that Upstream is building, but also by these networks that we're building across the state. Groups of people that want to be upstream together.
10:42:34 And then that increases the trust that we have in people that are different from us. And that allows us to build that cycle More and more, more quickly in louder ways so that more people see themselves as part of the solution and not part of
10:42:47 Either the crabby complaining environmentalists or the vilified users of this place that we have.
10:42:55 And it all starts by moving from our head to our heart.
10:42:59 And we do that with three upstream questions. So this is going to be a little audience participation part. Are people comfortable with that?
10:43:06 Yeah? Okay, I thought you might be here. Okay, so let's say… This side of the room is the traditional environmental narrative, and this side of the room is the upstream narrative.
10:43:17 So if I'm an environmental leader or a lawmaker looking to support some point that I have. And I come over to you and I say.
10:43:27 Should we mine more? Near the bottom of the waters. What does that do to you Yeah, it makes you all anxious, right? Okay. Or… Do we want to limit fertilizer use or do you actually want food in the grocery stores?
10:43:43 We're not giving you much of a position, right? Those are scary environmental questions that will shut people down. It'll make you go to your corners, and it'll make you kind of scared.
10:43:50 Now I come over here, and this is the upstream discussion, and I say.
10:43:54 What's your favorite place in Minnesota?
10:44:00 The North Shore, right? Lake Superior. And how do you like to use your favorite place in Minnesota?
10:44:09 Yeah. And then a question, what's one thing you do to care for this place?
10:44:13 What's one thing you do to care for this place that we share together?
10:44:17 Pick up litter. All right. Now, so we've built an emotional connection over the things that we share.
10:44:24 I've alienated you. I brought you into the tent. And now the three of us can talk about what are the best ways to protect Lake Superior or how can we inspire more litter or How do you want the water to be when you go swimming in it?
10:44:36 And those are the things that Upstream does to bring people in.
10:44:40 Into the fold. And now, because audience participation should always come with with a reward. I brought some… I brought some swag.
10:44:53 Yeah, we don't show up empty-handed. We did a partnership with Soda Clothing.
10:45:02 I think you might like that one. And here.
10:45:06 Awesome. Right? It's like holiday time. You get gifts. So our job is to move this discussion about how we care for this place from our heads.
10:45:20 Laws and rights and things that people want to fight over to our hearts.
10:45:23 Things that people connect over. Things that people relate over. So that we can move that discussion forward.
10:45:32 So… We do this in a couple ways. One is we find trusted messengers.
10:45:37 You know, I'm a liberal Unitarian from White Bear Lake. I'm not going to go into… a hall full of iron ore mariners in Virginia.
10:45:47 And start talking about how to care for this place. But I've got my partner here, John Arbogast, who's an iron miner. He's an upstreamer.
10:45:54 He goes into that room and he can have that discussion in a way that I never could.
10:45:58 This is Brad Donne. He's a dairy farmer from central Minnesota. He's a volunteer firefighter.
10:46:03 On the board of everything in Kimball. He's also a red Republican.
10:46:09 Twice Trump voter. He can go into the fire the fire department there and talk to people about ways to care for this place in a way that I never could.
10:46:18 That's Naimadora. She is a farmer, Somali farmer. She lives in Alexandria. She has a farm there She can talk to Somali people in a way that I never could.
10:46:27 So the whole idea of upstream is find people who are trusted in the communities and then arm them with these three questions, the three questions and then the things that follow those three questions.
10:46:35 So that we can build this movement. Passed small into statewide.
10:46:43 The second thing we're doing is creating shared spaces that encourage civility and respect. So we can't get to trust and connection without civility and respect. I think we can all pretty much agree on that.
10:46:52 If you show up right at a battle, people won't open up to you. If you show up with civility and respect.
10:46:56 They'll answer your questions. They'll engage with you. So we do a number of things that are called backyard conversations and unsung caretakers.
10:47:03 So backyard conversations are hosted small group forums. You share a meal together.
10:47:10 You have discussions about what connects you. Questions like, what's a stereotype about people.
10:47:20 That I would want to know that maybe you want to dispel a little bit.
10:47:22 So we get to these questions about the way we show up when it comes to environmentalism and care for place.
10:47:28 That allows us to start connecting across difference. I'm going to tell you about, oh, that one in the middle is at my yard. That was fun. We did a multi-generational one And White Bear Lake is a purplish place, so I invited a bunch of my neighbors over who vote different than I do.
10:47:42 That was a fun one. The group on the right is my friend John Larson.
10:47:46 I found out that one of your guests today knows him as well. So he was one of the leaders of the marriage equality campaign. He's a gay man, lives in, I think it's, is that Linden Hills, that's what that's considered.
10:47:57 Another person on the board of Upstream is the head of the Minnesota Catholic Conference.
10:48:02 So he is the guy that runs the public policy arm for the Catholic Church in Minnesota.
10:48:06 As you can imagine, those two were foes on the issues of marriage equality.
10:48:10 But on the issues of care for this place and stewardship of this place, they're actually friends.
10:48:14 So they brought together two groups of their friends. So mostly a group of gay South Minneapolitans and a group of Catholic Catholic Church, Catholic doctrine believers And brought them together over a meal in John's backyard and then had this really eye-opening discussion about
10:48:33 What unites, what the similarities were between those two groups. And it was like watching light bulbs come on. It was really fascinating because there were, you know, 95% of the things that we talked about people not just agreed on but sort of deeply agreed on, some coming from a faith perspective, some coming from a humanist perspective.
10:48:51 But really agreed on it. And it showed to me the power of upstream when you bring people together and you can lower that emotional temperature so that we can open up to the opportunities and possibilities that we share together.
10:49:02 And then the last part of what we do and the part that's really exciting for me is amplifying, reinforcing.
10:49:10 Our shared identity and values as stewards of this place. So we get to tell stories. This is the part that I really love.
10:49:15 Tell stories about the everyday heroes of Minnesota that are doing things to care for this place. And some of the things are big and grand, and it's people that have converted entire farms into pothole prairies But most people that's not accessible for, right?
10:49:29 So a lot of things we do is share stories about little acts that people have that are really replicable.
10:49:34 So one of the stories we share is about a woman who's given up single-use plastics.
10:49:40 So she is in a way that is really hard to do.
10:49:43 Has said, I'm not going to do that anymore. She's used the same laundry detergent bottle for 20 years.
10:49:47 She goes and fills it up at the cot. It inspired me to try and do that last year. And let me tell you.
10:49:51 Cutting single-use plastics out of your life is really, really hard.
10:49:56 But I probably use 75% less plastic than I did the year before.
10:50:00 So it's these sort of small things that we can do that we can replicate that bring You know, it's going to have a net positive effect not just on the place that we share, but also the way we feel about each other.
10:50:12 So the goals of this campaign are fourfold. The first is we want to bridge. We want to bridge And build renewed relationship between people who are who villainize each other, who other each other.
10:50:26 The things that stand in the way of us working together.
10:50:30 We want to increase the feeling of belonging, and this is through shared stories and shared identity.
10:50:35 So these are the stories about values that we can share that allow us to see the humanity in each other.
10:50:42 Lowering the temperature, the temperature around environmental discourse So that policymakers and practice makers can actually do the work and feel supported in it, do the right things for this for the state that we have. And then lastly, build a unified culture. Build this idea that
10:50:59 Being Minnesota is special. It's different than being Iowan or North Dakota or South Dakota or Wisconsinite?
10:51:05 On a Packers Vikings Sunday. That's an important one to call out, right?
10:51:10 But that being Minnesotan means something different. It means that we care for this place and we care for each other.
10:51:15 And that's the goal of upstream. So here's a few things that we can ask you to do to help support this campaign. The first is an easy one.
10:51:23 Come to our website and take the upstream pledge. And there's three components to the pledge.
10:51:28 One with your voice, and that's tell a story about either something you do to care for this place or maybe something a neighbor does or maybe something your congregation as a whole does.
10:51:37 So that's one. Share a story. The second is, we call it find your next. But find the next thing you want to do to care for this place. So we actually have on our site.
10:51:46 A wiki of different environmental activities that you can do And this is shared by people are like us. These are regular everyday Minnesotans.
10:51:56 And we have it organized by category, so it's like. Care at home, care on the move, care on vacation. So you can go in and say, what's an area of my life that I want to make friendlier to Minnesota?
10:52:05 So the second thing is an action to do with your hands. So find your necks, do the thing that do the next thing to care for this place. And the last one I think is going to resonate with your mission here at Pilgrim House.
10:52:17 And that is to open your heart and open your mind to different ways of doing things.
10:52:21 So the people that maybe you internally villainize or push to the side or think that maybe they're not doing the right thing for Minnesota and for our earth.
10:52:32 Look for the things that they do that that actually make a difference. So find the things about the work that they do, the beliefs that they hold.
10:52:39 That actually are in alignment with yours. So open your heart. So go and take our pledge.
10:52:43 It takes about five minutes. You'll give us your email address. We can send you fun stuff like that.
10:52:48 The second is host a backyard conversation. So either we could do that as your congregation or individually if you want to gather some friends and find someone who's different than you and have them gather friends So that we can learn about each other. It's a really fun activity. We'll help you. We'll provide the food and that kind of stuff.
10:53:04 And then we'll help facilitate that experience. But that's a really fun one to do.
10:53:09 The third is donate to upstream.org if you're so moved. And then lastly, just something really easy and fun to do. Go to our website, go to our social media.
10:53:18 Follow and share the stories that inspire you. So it's fun for me to be at a UU congregation. I grew up at Unity in St. Paul. I think Lolly mentioned that.
10:53:30 And when I was growing up the minister, open every sermon with a statement that was, the place where we meet to seek the highest is holy ground.
10:53:41 And when I was young, it didn't really resonate with me. I didn't really understand it.
10:53:45 But as I've gotten older, the idea that sort of the places where people are together looking for something larger themselves is actually where where the spirit actually is.
10:53:55 And so that's really what Upstream is. So it's a really nice merging between faith and my passion for environmentalism.
10:54:02 And for me, this happens outdoors. This happens on a hiking trail with my family or it's at the dog park with the people that that are there and care for that place.
10:54:12 But you see the spirit show up when we're together, especially when we're together outdoors in in creation. So I'd invite you to reflect on the idea that Wherever we're together outdoors, we have the chance to make something really special and spiritual.
10:54:28 And Upstream is here to make sure that we protect that that we bond together over that and that it's there for generations to come.
10:54:36 Thank you for having me here this morning. Sure, happy to take some questions.
10:54:47 Or comments? Comments, questions, joys, concerns? Concerns. Tell your story. Yeah.
10:54:58 Just want to share a story. So yesterday, the weather was nice, so I thought, okay, I'll go out and pick up trash.
10:55:04 And I have to say, I know Maryland's again single use plastic, but I have Target bags so I always figure if I pick up trash with my target bags were good. So I went out with another family member And we picked up eight bags of
10:55:19 Target trash, you know, I mean, not just Target Bank, but using the bags.
10:55:23 But while we were doing it, it was really kind of funny because Another gentleman saw us.
10:55:30 And he joined in. And I thought it was really kind of touching that he could see what we were doing and he went and picked up some stuff and helped us clean up a little bit, so I thought that was cool.
10:55:42 Yeah, it's cool. One of the things that we found through, I mean, we know this instinctually.
10:55:47 But we did a bunch of research. And when you expose people to the list of ways to be a better citizen of the earth, or here are the things that the environmental organizations tell you to do.
10:55:57 People actually get turned off by it. Preachy and it makes me feel bad.
10:56:02 When people hear stories from people people that look, sound.
10:56:06 And that people recognize. They're inspired to do more of that work. So part of our goal is to tell those kinds of stories. I'll share one story about a guy named Henry LaBanta. So he was one of our unsung caretakers that we recognized at an event last year.
10:56:20 And his nickname is the Trash Man of Uptown. And so he and his dog, a golden retriever at this really, really beautiful golden retriever.
10:56:28 Walk around Uptown and he's always got a plastic five gallon pail and like one of those pickers like you see at the state fair.
10:56:34 And when he takes the dog for a walk, he fills up five gallon bucket. And he kept track of what he did over the years and like how many hypodermic needles and crazy stuff like that.
10:56:44 And then he noticed that other people started doing the same thing. So they took this idea of formalizing the program to the neighborhood association, the East Isles organization. Upstream was actually able to fiscal sponsor it now, so it's kind of fun
10:56:59 And so now there's eight neighborhoods around the Chain of Lakes that are organizing this idea so they do group purchasing of these plastic bucklers and pickers. They've organized with a couple of the local restaurants so that they can dump their trash there in the big
10:57:13 In the big receptacles. So it is this idea of how one person just taking action and doing a little bit of something will inspire other people to emulate it. And when you think about that, not so much in the.
10:57:23 How do I want to do that? But in the power that we have through our stories and our examples to inspire people.
10:57:30 It's a really powerful method. So what's the thing that you can do?
10:57:33 To inspire someone to act in a better way for Minnesota.
10:57:51 I'd like to hear more about the next step. Getting acquainted to people talking about the hard issues.
10:57:58 Yeah, so how you get them from being in relationship with each other to having the discussion about about what we do from a policy perspective. Is that the question?
10:58:08 Well, what we all understand is the topics you avoid… When you get together, you don't talk about politics Or religion. Right. So we will talk about politics and policy probably not religion so much, although if that shows up in the discussion, that's fine.
10:58:28 But it's after we've built a level of trust between each other. So for us, it's about an 18-month process to bring people into the upstream fold Have a backyard conversation with them.
10:58:38 Have them start telling stories before we'll engage with them about what are the policy goals that you have.
10:58:45 And who can support that? Who's aligned with you? And our goal is that we build a broad spectrum of support for things that Minnesotans want to change. So whether that's water protection or mining laws or whatever the case might be. We're not there yet with upstream.
10:59:01 But the whole idea is knit. Knit together a broad base of support that process, politics, race, and geography.
10:59:08 Before anything comes to to a policy position.
10:59:17 I… I want to ask you a question about politics.
10:59:22 You see Leon Musk as… exerting some… liberal views on Trump.
10:59:31 I didn't understand the question.
10:59:37 I would think Elon Musk… Manufacturing electric cars into SpaceX and so forth he's He's going to be a stabilizing force Boy, one might hope. I don't know. That's above my pay grade, I'm afraid.
11:00:01 So I'm going to tie this back to upstream and totally avoid your question.
11:00:07 And not really. So one of the reasons why we decided to test this in Minnesota is because there's a strong sense of identity with the state.
11:00:16 That doesn't translate the larger you get. So I'll punt on any national politics and say that In Minnesota, we feel like we can build a big enough block that environmental protections can be durable.
11:00:27 And that's really our end goal. Is that we bring enough people together who identify as Republican and Democrat.
11:00:34 People from all over the state so that we can build durable environmental policy. It doesn't change at the whim of whoever was last elected.
11:00:47 Boy, just taking the step that you've taken. Is amazing.
11:00:57 My question basically revolves around mining. I mean, I… Farming, I can see that there's a path forward.
11:01:08 That sustainable farming is something that we need, something that even farmers can understand.
11:01:14 Mining is so different. And how do you… get the wedge into that crack to actually move forward.
11:01:24 It's a really good question, and it's obviously sticky, otherwise we would have solved this, right?
11:01:29 And my… So this is Andy's view, not upstream's view. So let me just make that.
11:01:35 Clear. I got the chance a couple years ago to go on a trip down a tributary to the Amazon.
11:01:41 And along that, so we were on boats. I think it was called Madre de Dios, so the Mother of God River, and it was in the Peruvian rainforest and went down into Brazil.
11:01:52 And one of the things that I saw were strip mines all along the Amazon River.
11:01:58 And they were the worst thing I've ever seen. Like… you would go through this lush rainforest wildlife, and then you would pass a strip mine and it would just be like a muddy slough that went on for miles and miles.
11:02:14 And the color of the river after that changed. And the effluvians from the Amazon now is going further and further out into the Atlantic.
11:02:22 Wrecking things, like totally destroying things. And then I think about If we're going to mine.
11:02:29 Let's mine in the best way possible. And we're going to mine.
11:02:32 I've got a cell phone and a laptop that they take metals that we have to pull out of there. So the modern conveniences.
11:02:40 That Elon Musk is using in his electric cars. Come from somewhere, right? So my thought… is that if we're going to mine, let's mine in a place where we're going to protect the Earth as best we can.
11:02:50 And I think we can probably do that better in Minnesota than almost anywhere else in the US.
11:02:56 So my thing isn't probably… I don't know if it's popular. It's just the position I own, which is We can do it better here.
11:03:04 And if we're going to mine, let's make sure that we hold the mining company's feet to the fire. And that will only happen if the lawmakers know that they have the backs and support of the people.
11:03:13 So it's a sticky wicket. And there's no perfect answer to it.
11:03:18 But I can tell you I've seen what happens when you mine with no environmental protection.
11:03:23 And it's a disaster. And we can't let that happen in Minnesota.
11:03:29 Well, you probably answered some of my question because I am concerned about the nickel mining.
11:03:35 And have read that they're saying, oh, well, we'll do it right, we'll do this. But it's easy to promise. And when you get down there.
11:03:44 The risks are. And the other piece is in farming in northwest corner where it's gotten very hot up there, how they farm so differently. There's no plowing, there's no disking.
11:03:58 Everything is done with high-powered drills. The way they harvest is totally different.
11:04:07 Than my childhood. And there's thousands of acres. And obviously the farmers have joined in and support one another to do it either It's very costly, very, very costly.
11:04:22 So they certainly reduce the amount of fertilizers, the amount of pollution, the amount of But anyway, change is certain.
11:04:32 But I'd be interested in your comment on the nickel mine particular.
11:04:38 I think it's the same as the answer over here, which is if we're going to do it, let's make sure we do it the best in the world.
11:04:44 And if Minnesotans demand that. Then it can happen. But until we do.
11:04:49 They're going to do the less expensive option, right? And the farming stuff is really interesting.
11:04:56 Because we are at a tipping point where the cost is coming down and acceptance is up.
11:05:00 And one of the things that we get to do is tell stories about farmers that are early adopters and sort of make them into the hero.
11:05:05 And give them the mic so that they can tell the story to their neighbors. There's still a lot of resistance to to a lot of the practices. But we're doing pretty intensive work in Fergus Falls to help which is sort of in the part of the state you're talking about.
11:05:18 To help people learn about cover crops and winter wheat and all the things that make the soil and replenish the soil.
11:05:25 Because right now the soil quality in Minnesota is going down really fast.
11:05:30 So the people part of that equation is give the microphone to the people who are doing the best work and then amplify that so that people who maybe are a little bit resistant see folks that look like them and sound like them and speak the language of agriculture telling stories about how they are able to be profitable
11:05:46 Doing these things that are still good for the world.
11:05:52 And I would say just the other I didn't talk about this very much. The other part of what we're doing, so we're at the sort of intersection of environment and civility or a civic fabric is making sure that when the next disaster strikes.
11:06:08 When the thing happens that we're in good enough relationship with each other that we can be resilient and not be at each other's throats.
11:06:14 I came into this work because I was a frustrated environmentalist.
11:06:18 And I'm leaving hopeful because I'm leaving hopeful I think the biggest challenge of our time is the othering.
11:06:24 And the villainization that we have of people that that we'll never know.
11:06:29 We may not get to the point where we may not we have the perfect answer on mining or on agriculture, but we can get to the point where we recognize each other as people again.
11:06:39 And are in relationship with each other so that we can be resilient when the world changes around us.
11:06:55 So actually, how long have you been in existence and What is your growth rate in terms of your organization? Yeah, that's a great question.
11:07:07 We've been public since 2021, so we're on our fourth year now.
11:07:12 We think that If we can attract the funding we need.
11:07:15 That this is probably a six-year campaign and that's been the, I mean, it's been really hard to find funding for what's basically a big social experiment.
11:07:24 So I think over the next couple of years, we'll find out in these, we're doing upstream communities, Fergus Falls, the Iron Range, and East St. Paul And we're going to show proof of concept that we've changed the way people feel about each other and about
11:07:37 Environmental policy. And if that happens, I think we raise the kind of money we need to expand it to a statewide campaign.
11:07:43 And then it's probably five years of that. And if these… if these test communities don't work.
11:07:50 Or we can't show sort of measurable change, then I think we're probably going to say we tried. That was part of our goal
11:08:04 All right. Thank you. Thank you very much.
11:08:22 Nice picture.
11:08:28 Nice job, Keewee.
11:08:34 All right, next song. Thank you very much, Andy.
11:08:40 Very inspirational.
11:08:49 Our next song is… Old Lang Zein, the original.
11:08:56 Yeah. This is a practice song for this week. So we did the Christmas old Langsein to close out Last week's program.
11:09:09 But this is the New Year's. Old Lang Zane, and I just appropriate as we get together. So please sing along.
11:11:59 Mix everything together. I like it. All right, let's extinguish the chalice.
11:12:10 We extinguish this flame. But not the light of truth.
11:12:15 The warmth of community or the fire of commitment. These we carry in our hearts.
11:12:22 Until we are together again. Next week… I should do something is… Well, it's up there, right? We usually do thanks first. We'll go ahead and do this.
11:12:38 James Patrick Barone, is that how you say it, Barone? Which one?
11:12:45 Barone, okay, we'll be here. He is an attorney and he is an attorney an actor from St. Paul, I believe.
11:12:55 Is that correct? Yes. So he'll be telling us how one can make a living and still do what you love.
11:13:01 Sounds interesting. It would be very entertaining, I think.
11:13:06 I'd like to thank Andy again for coming. Thank you for coming out on this.
11:13:14 Well, it's not blessed streak. Hard to see day. And thanks to Mel for being a greeter.
11:13:20 Les Rogers helped set up the treats. On today's cleanup, we have everyone here helping themselves to help each other.
11:13:30 So if you can bust your own dishes, that'd be great. Technology is Fred. Awesome job, Fred.
11:13:37 Running camera sound and camera or the… Or the whatever, the slides.
11:13:43 Thanks. So we will see you all next year.
11:13:50 Next week. And have a great week.